Militairement Napoléon...

Je suis condescendant, je suis sophiste, insultes, insultes... Mais toujours pas un argument de fond

C'est désolant...

Louis XIV --> Napoléon

Deux des pires monarques français, avec François 1er

On est pas dans un débat la crétinus.
Tu te permets des choses intolérable compte tenu de ta personne.
C'est juste un recadrement pour que tu puisse comprendre par toi même qui tu es

Il a tellement de style, qu'on lui pardonne ces erreurs

Et toujours rien, tu craches ta haine sur moi parce que tu es incapable de soutenir un débat d'idées

J'ai l'impression que tu es sur le point de pleurer de rage derrière ton écran parce que ton égo est incapable d'encaisser la moindre critique cohérente à tes idées simplistes

Les bonapartistes sont uniquement dans l'esthétisme

Bof, je suis pas fan de Napoléon perso Trop surestimé, en plus d'être un gros cocu

Je m'en doute, ce n'était pas une attaque personnelle clé. Où te situes-tu idéologiquement ? Philosophiquement ?

Encore une énième fraude ou du moins, surcôtage historique

Je trouve quand même qu'il a eu la gnaque de revenir de son exil sur son île pourrie, reprendre le pouvoir comme si de rien n'était et relancer une campagne jusqu'à sa défaite finale et retour sur une autre île pourrie. Il devait avoir un côté galvanisateur d'hommes.

Le problème c'est qu'il laisse derrière lui un cimetière démographique

Regardes sa campagne d'Italie et on en rediscute après

We are far from seeing a field for great genius in a case
which admits only of the application of a few SImple
combinations,
and we think it exceedingly ridiculous
to hold up, as is often done, the turning of a position as
an invention showing the highest gemus ; still neverthe
less this creative self-activity on the part of the critic is
necessary, and it is one of the points which essentially
determine the value of critical exammation,
When Buonaparte on 30th July, 1796,of< determined
to raise the siege of Mantua, in order to march WIth his
whole force agamst the enemy, advancing in separate
columns to the relief of the place, and to beat them in
detail, this appeared the surest way to the attainment
of brilliant victories.
These victories actually followed, and were afterwards again repeated on a still more bnlhant
scale on the attempt to relieve the fortress bemg again
renewed.
We hear only one opmion on these achieve
ments, that of unmixed admiration,
At the same time, Buonaparte could not have adopted
this course on the 30th July Without quite grvmg up
the idea of the siege of Mantua, because it was Impossible
to save the siege train, and it could not be replaced by
another in this campaign. In fact, the siege was con
verted into a blockade, and the town, which if the siege
had continued must have very shortly fallen, held out
for six months in spite of Buonaparte's victories in the
open field.
Criticism has generally regarded this as an evil that
was unavoidable, because critics have not been able to
suggest any better course. Resistance to a relieving
Army within lmes of circumvallation had fallen into
such disrepute and contempt that It appears to have
entirely escaped consideration as a means. And yet in
the reign of Louis XIV. that measure was so often used
WIth success that we can only attribute to the force of
fashion the fact that a hundred years later It never
occurred to anyone even to propose such a measure.
If the practicability of such a plan had ever been enter
tamed for a moment, a closer consideration of circum
stances would have shown that 40,000 of the best infantry
in the world under Buonaparte, behind strong lmes of
circumvallation round Mantua, had so httle to fear from
the 50,000 men commg to the relief under Wurmser, that
it was very unlikely that any attempt even would be
made upon their lmes. We shall not seek here to establish
this point, but we believe enough has been said to show
that this means was one which had a nght to a share of
consideration.
Whether Buonaparte himself ever thought
of such a plan we leave undecided; neither inhis memoirs
nor in other sources is there any trace to be found of his
having done so; in no cntical works has it been touched
upon, the measure being one WhICh the mind had lost
sight of. The ment of resuscitating the idea of this
means is not great, for it suggests itself at once to any
one who breaks loose from the trammels of fashion,
Still it is necessary that it should suggest itself for us to
bnng It into consideration and compare it with the means
which Buonaparte employed. Whatever may be the
result of the companson, It is one which should not be
omitted by criticism.





Clausewitz, De la Guerre, pages 139 à 142 (de l'édition que j'ai, mais en tout cas c'est dans le livre 2). C'est ce que j'ai trouvé en dix minutes je précise, si tu en veux plus je peux continuer

Complètement brised

Ah pour sûr il avait la niaque, et comme je l'ai dit c'était un tribun. Je lui retire juste sa casquette de génie tactique

Comme toujours...

J'ai regardé, tu veux discuter de quoi ? du siège de Mantoue où son erreur a coûté la vie à des milliers d'hommes ? dans une campagne contre quelques principats désunis ?

Effectivement, ce que nient les idolâtres bonapartistes

When Buonaparte, in February, r8r4,* after gaining
the battles at Etoges, Champ-Aubert, and Montmirail,
left Blucher's Army, and turning upon Schwartzenberg,
beat his troops at l\lontereau and Mormant, every one
was filled WIth admiration, because Buonaparte, by thus
throwmg hIS concentrated force first upon one opponent,
then upon another. made a br.lhant use of the mistakes
WhICh hIS adversaries had committed in dividing their
forces.
If these bnlliant strokes 10 different directions
failed to save him, it was generally considered to be no
fault of hIS, at least. No one has yet asked the question,
What would have been the result if, instead of turning
from Blucher upon Schwartzenberg, he had tried another
blow at Blucher, and pu=ucd him to the Rhine? We
are convinced that It would have completely changed the
course of the campaign, and that the Army of the Allies,
instead of marching to Pans. would have retired behind
the Rhme. We do not ask others to share our conviction,
but no one who understands the thmg will doubt, at the
mere mention of this alternative course, that it is one
which should not be overlooked in criticism.

Page 143 encore une erreur de ton empereur chéri qui lui a coûté énormément

Bordel et tu veux me faire croire que t'as lu le bouquin

mais wayooo plus gros le troll

une campagne en infériorité numérique chronique

from "Promu général de la pire armée Française juste parce qu'il a sauvé le gouvernement d'une émeute" à "Fait capituler l'Autriche à lui seul"

When Buonaparte marched to Moscow in 18I2, all
depended upon whether the taking of the capital, and the
events which preceded the capture, would force the
Emperor Alexander to make peace, as he had been com
pelled to do after the battle of Friedland in 1807. and
the Emperor Francis m 1805 and 1809 after Austerlitz
and Wagram; for if Buonaparte did not obtain a peace
at Moscow, there was no alternative but to return-that
IS, there was nothing for him but a strategic defeat.
We shall leave out of the question what he did to get to
Moscow, and whether in hISadvance he did not miss many
opportunities of bringing the Emperor Alexander to peace;
we shall also exclude all consideration of the disastrous
circumstances which attended his retreat, and which
perhaps had their origin in the general conduct of the
campaign. Still the question remains the same, for
however much more brilliant the course of the campaign
up to Moscow might have been, still there was always
an uncertainty whether the Emperor Alexander would be
intimidated into making peace; and then, even if a retreat
did not contain in itself the seeds of such disasters as did
in fact occur, still it could never be anything else than a
great strategic defeat.




Page 150, un dernier pour la route

La pire armée française ?

Combien de coalitions les révolutionnaires ont-ils ridiculisés ?

Lis les extraits de Clausewitz que j'ai mis en réponse à l'autre idolâtre bonapartiste, il parle assez bien de la campagne d'Italie